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 Gothling no more? 
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Post Gothling no more?
The domain name is up for renewal at the end of the month. Hypoxia never really logs on anymore because she couldn't really care less about this "scene." It's stabbed her in the back enough where she really couldn't give two shits about it. She doesn't feel the need to put any effort into this board since there doesn't seem to be any point in doing so.

I question the point of remaining here as well. Sure, it's been an online hangout for a number of years, but it's way past its prime. This board peaked about three or four years ago and has been on a downward slide ever since. The main site was plagued with bugs and had to be shut down after a number of people who stated they could fix the problems proceeded to do absolutely nothing. Now we're left with a busted-ass message board that's plagued by spambots on an hourly basis. All I really do at this point is log on once a day and delete all their posts.

The main reason why this board hasn't really taken off the way TC Punk did is because darksiders really fucking suck at holding a conversation. A message board needs good conversationalists, particularly those with a wry sense of humor. Goths/darksiders tend to have neither conversational skills or much of a sense of humor. Hence, this board is a failure.

In spite of the memberlist, there's really only a handful of people who regularly contribute. Is it worth keeping the domain name for that? Hypoxia has left it up to me. If I tell her to renew the domain name, she will. If I say I don't care, well...goodbye Gothling. Expect to make an attempt to log on and find nothing to log on to.

I guess I'm torn. I know some people check in for the Events forum, but hell, the darkside/hardline lists pretty much have that covered already. I'm having a lot of trouble seeing the point of keeping this rickety piece of shit going.

Maybe it's time to drive the stake through the heart of this particular project. I'm certainly not at all convinced that it would be sorely missed by many.

I just figured I'd give everyone a heads up so that the end result doesn't come as a huge surprise.


Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:07 pm
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I would miss it, and then I'd log in to TC punk...

IMHO- see if members here could

1) come up with the $$$ for the domain name.

2) could build a non-python site to attach the board to. there may be some interest in that.

I think if you can meet those two things, it would prove that therhe's enough interest to keep it going.

I agree about the conversational ability and esp the sense of humor, or rather, not. I definitely thinkt he "scene" needs to be kicked in the ass, and I think fresh blood working on something like this would probably help.

However, that said, I'm sure as shit not willing to put any time and energy into anything goth or darksider in this town, and I don't blame anyone else for feeling the same way. (I don't even want to play music here any more).

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Tue Aug 15, 2006 2:26 am
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<i>I know some people check in for the Events forum, but hell, the darkside/hardline lists pretty much have that covered already.</i>

Hm. Maybe they could or once did, but unless there's another subscription that I haven't seen, they do not, and have not, for some time. And that's a shame. I've found out about a number of shows through this medium that I quite enjoyed.

I'm afraid I don't know anything about programming or fixing this thing, in that regard I have nothing to offer. How much money is a domain name? Would we be just as well-served by having a livejournal community and not worrying about upkeep? I wonder who maintains mspgoth there.

Pity. I rather like low-volume message boards. They're easier to keep track of.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:20 am
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I got very disappointed with seeing the "Goth Scene" here go from the likes of the excellence of Dark Carnival, Heathen et al to fey Disco Dancing to Records.



I've been on here very little these days, I gave up my personal Zomboard recently and shut it down due to some issues so I certainly understand if this goes away.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:54 am
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MySpace and LiveJournal disease?

Perhaps sell it to the highest "local" bidder.

Perhaps use a free message board system, to remove the technical headache.

Perhaps refocus the whole site, as a non-message board darksider blog, event post, links post, or some such.

It should def. be renewed, before or after new-blooding.

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Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:55 am
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Please keep the board alive. This is all we really have. It would really suck to start a myspace page, livejournal page, or weed through other message boards topics to find dark things goings on.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 11:58 am
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i still hang out here.

i am awesome.

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Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:47 pm
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This is my major lifeline to my friends back in Mpls
I guess I'm one of the few contribuators and I hope I'm one of the "intelligent conversators"
There's nothing I can do if you wanna end it though

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Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:55 pm
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actually, I would be willing to be a mod.

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Tue Aug 15, 2006 1:09 pm
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I would say the two main purposes for this board are events and to help out-of-towners. I think it still has pretty good value in those two areas.

Other then that it really doesn't do much. I still log in everyday and wish it had move activity, but it just doesn't get much traffic and/or the people who do come don't post anything.

I would miss it though, heck in Jan I'll have been here 4 years.

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Tue Aug 15, 2006 2:07 pm
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Well, I will admit that I don't come here as frequently as I'd like. Most of the time I just login to see what events are going on (and concerts). I also tend to "lurk" and not post unless I feel that my opinion means anything (which isn't very often :-P).

Though, I do think we should still keep this board alive. It doesn't necessarily have to have its own domain name like it does now. Hell, if you even go on Yahoo, MSN or AOL, they all have the option to form "groups" where you can start your own messageboard for free.

That may be an option.

I tend to use LiveJournal most of the time to converse with my goth/darksider friends. I also have a MySpace, but I find that most people on here and LJ avoid it like the plague (I can't say I blame you... they're always having website/server issues there).

But yeah... I'd hate to see this board totally die-out. Maybe a move should be in order. I'd be willing to help out in any way I can as well (thanks for stepping up, too, Drok).


Tue Aug 15, 2006 2:12 pm
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There will be no moves. There will be no moderator additions. There will be no selling it, as there is nothing to sell and that's rather illegal anyway because of how it's set up.

There is nobody who is willing to donate time to overhaul it. I've been lied to enough times by so many of you regarding overhauling or restructuring or rewriting it that I'm done trying.

Domain names are fifteen bucks. The price is not an issue.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 2:57 pm
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How much would it cost to re-up the domain? If there are enough people on here who want this to continue, then they (including me) can contribute.
I do like coming on here, and conversing or babbling to my heart's content. I would be sorry if this went away.

edit: and it looks like my question was answered while I wrote this. I would be willing to pay the $15, having made several friends from here, and therefore easily justifying the expense. I know next to nothing about computers, so someone else would have to do the upkeep.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:06 pm
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I still visit & enjoy Gothling, the Events Discussion is very handy. The spambots are fuckin annoying tho. But it isn't anymore "spam" than what you see on the LJ or MS.
Keep in mind even tcpunk pulled the plug once, some say because there was "too much discussion".


Tue Aug 15, 2006 6:20 pm
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what skills are needed for such an overhaul, and what are needed for maintenance? If the overhaul is a once a year or one-shot thing, maybe we could pitch in to pay for some work.

volunteer work is often not taken all that seriously, I'm afraid.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 6:47 pm
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I'd bet most bots would be stoppable with a quick customization of the new user sign-up form, just by adding another input field that isn't built into phpbb, (e.g. "Are you a spam-bot? (x)Yes (_)No"), and then verifying that field's value before creating the account.

I'm not sure how smart these bots are, but I'm sure they're outsmarttable somehow. I haven't programmed in PHP but I'm sure I could figure out the syntax and extend what's already there. Unfortunately, a mere willingness to put time/effort into tinkering and testing it is insufficient, since making changes would require some sort of physical (or remote/ftp/???) access to the server...

...and I get a lil' gun-shy when I recall what happened <i>last time</i> somebody had that level of access.


Another way is to just hand-delete all the spam posts (and spurious user accounts)... and since additional moderators have been ruled out, that means that whatever poor bastards are moderators now have to do it.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:04 pm
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I for one would definitely miss this place, I've met a lot of great people here that I would like to get back in touch with since I re-acquired internet access. I was once a moderator, but unfortunately that effort went down the drain when i was without internet access for over a year. There's nothing I can really do if you decide to pull the plug, but I'll miss everyone whom I've ever made a connection with here.


Tue Aug 15, 2006 8:13 pm
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hypoxia wrote:
There will be no moderator additions.


what about replacements for the mods who have FQ,Sed?

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Tue Aug 15, 2006 9:15 pm
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What's FQ,Sed?

drok_vox wrote:
hypoxia wrote:
There will be no moderator additions.


what about replacements for the mods who have FQ,Sed?


Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:50 am
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Only admins can delete the spam, and each account has to be done by hand, and there are only two admins, neither of whom has that kind of patience. *heh*


Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:51 am
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Fucking

Quit,





Seriously.

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Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:30 am
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I've found gothling to have been an excellent way of finding out about events and of getting to know people in the scene.

Especially in that I'm somewhat of an anomaly in the demographic, it has helped for people to run across my "handle" on a gothling comment and subsequently meet me I.P., feeling more at ease that I'm, in truth, one of them.

That said, my own "deep discussions" with people usually happen on more on LJ these days, but still ocassionally on Gothling...

whatever technical and formatting quirks Gothling might have, it is still an oasis of calm and organization compared to MySpaced-out.

And that all said, GCHE and Hypoxia should be commended for keeping this thing going, despite the sometimes fractious drama to which we gothy-sorts are sometimes prone.


Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:41 am
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I've never understood... is the problem the amount of work the site needs, or is it the dream of a Cadillac site versus a very functional Chevrolet site?

If dropping some vision to end the pain will work... do it.

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Wed Aug 16, 2006 9:29 am
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It's never going to be a Cadillac site. There's no point in even hoping for that now.

I thought it was a lot cooler when we had a full site, with the link engine, band and club info, reviews, etc. But all that broke and there's no one to fix it. We're left with this message board that's plagued by spambots, but otherwise still works (for the most part). I don't necessarily have a problem with that.

I've seen activity on the board dwindle to the point where I question its reason for existence. Yes, over the years many have come through here and an astonishing amount have hooked up and befriended people they otherwise may never have met. That's great. Warms my damn cockles and all. But at this point there's about 10-20 people (and it may not even be that many) that regularly check in here and participate. Not many start new threads. The Events forum gets the most activity and, actually, hundreds of people check in to that forum, most in a "guest" capacity (in other words, non-members). Hey man, that's cool. Maybe we should just edit this message board down to an events forum because, from where I'm sittin', that's the only part of this whole thing that seems to be of much interest to anyone.

This was a good thing for quite a while. But to check in here everyday to see nothing new but spam posts is irritating and, frankly, a waste of time. There isn't much life in this "scene," and I question the need for a message board to cater to it.


Wed Aug 16, 2006 8:43 pm
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well, I think the old site was creating the traffic for the board...

site go down, traffic go down, new people membership drop, etc...

also, myspace virus has caught most of the planet so far (et tu, zom-zom?)

in another year or so, myspace hysteria will back down, and sites with message boards will get going again...

the question I have, for the members of this board, especially the ones that pimp their bands on the board, and for the admins

can an html site be built that everyone would be okay with? the old site was fantastic, bt pythin prgrammers are no more...

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Wed Aug 16, 2006 10:03 pm
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The problem is the amount of work the site needs and how many people have lied to me and said they could fix it, and then just never bothered to do it and gave me pitiful excuses as to why they never got around to it.

Given that, how the hell does one drop some vision to end the pain, other than deleting the board?

Drok, this IS an HTML site, with some PHP. I did the HTML by hand(with some templates) on over three hundred pages nearly daily for five years.



veinsplasher wrote:
I've never understood... is the problem the amount of work the site needs, or is it the dream of a Cadillac site versus a very functional Chevrolet site?

If dropping some vision to end the pain will work... do it.


Thu Aug 17, 2006 7:01 am
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hypoxia wrote:
how the hell does one drop some vision to end the pain, other than deleting the board?


Dunno. Lose the message board, make it a one page resource... like Drudge Report, edit it down to just "events", as GCHE said, ...anything to get over this bitterness.

Deleting it seems too "baby with the bathwater", to me.

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Last edited by veinsplasher on Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:41 am, edited 1 time in total.



Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:20 am
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I have a myspace page, I look at it maybe once a month. Loads too slow, too much shit, uninteresting to me. I post on a few boards, they're still the best and most interesting medium to me.


Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:38 am
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if the old site was all just html, how the hell did we 'lose it'?

html isn't particularly difficult to maintain, so long as you don't get lazy (like, oh, me. which is why i ain't volunteering)

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Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:53 am
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...or we could just all head over to Ed's Room and take over...
(this is a terrible suggestion.)

How 'bout a wiki site instead of a BBS? like this one:
waste.org/burn

I don' t know how stuff like this is done, but I'm interested in being less ignorant and more skilled.


Thu Aug 17, 2006 11:22 am
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HTML is not difficult. It's time consuming. Over 300 pages, even templated, takes time. I don't have it. I have a real career.

No, I'm not bitter. I'm tired. I'm tired of having people make empty promises and then I discover the true value of their word.

thosquanta wrote:
if the old site was all just html, how the hell did we 'lose it'?

html isn't particularly difficult to maintain, so long as you don't get lazy (like, oh, me. which is why i ain't volunteering)


Thu Aug 17, 2006 5:08 pm
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zom-zom wrote:
I have a myspace page, I look at it maybe once a month. Loads too slow, too much shit, uninteresting to me. I post on a few boards, they're still the best and most interesting medium to me.

We stand united zom!


Thu Aug 17, 2006 7:16 pm
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Here's a semi-outsider's opinion:

If it's not the Admin's thing anymore, if it's not your vision, not getting traffic, or too much of a hassle, what better way than to move on?

http://directory.sootle.com/website-worth/tata.php

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Fri Aug 18, 2006 9:12 am
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hypoxia wrote:
HTML is not difficult. It's time consuming.


thats fo damn sure. luckily, my 'real' carreer allows me to play online all day. woohoo!

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Fri Aug 18, 2006 11:30 am
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if the scene (along with its people) suck so bad & people dont want to revamp it for free. a myspace group would an alternative.


Fri Aug 18, 2006 12:40 pm
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<b>MySpace users hit by hacker virus</b>

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1770

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Fri Aug 18, 2006 12:51 pm
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Hmm.

I'm kinda torn myself.

On the onehand, I grew up here, more or less, I went from a ranting kid, to a ranting adult.

I'm nineteen years old now. I came here firs when I was fifteen. That's, like, what? Four years? This place means a lot to me.

On the other hand, I feel like everything that needs to be said, has been said.

Goth, as an actual cultural phenomenon, died some years back. It's a fascinating, interesting, incredibly deep and meaningful thing, but I feel like it's already been fully discussed. We've talked about nearly everything there is to talk about, and that's why we aren't posting new threads. We're out of fucking ideas.

The punk boards have an easier time because people are still making listenable punk music, as shitty as most of it is. Goth, though, never wanted to just be about the music, although it was, and so we disavow all new goth bands, which is a good deal because new goth bands tend to suck (with the exception of most of the bands on this board).

I'm a much cooler guy now than I was back when I came here, and I'm glad I came here.

But this chapter seems to be over. I'll miss this place, but my involvement in online communities is mostly dead anyway. I don't have the patience for it. This is the only place I really felt at home, but I think it may be time for the doors to close.

God, it really scares me to say that. It just sounds so final and assholish, which, I know, I can come across as most of the time.

It actually reminds me of this dream I had last night of me helping Kelsey Grammar sing opera on "America's Got Talent", and then being brushed off by him after the show. Hell, even David Hyde Pierce, who was helping him too, wouldn't talk to me.

Assholes.

Eh, it's up to you guys.

Hypoxia, you have my deepest respect and love, if you decide to keep the site around, I'll be grateful, if not, I understand completely.

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Sun Aug 20, 2006 1:37 pm
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If you guys want to turn to the vapid, pop-culture black hole that is MySpace, that's your choice. It's certainly not something I would ever support. There isn't many positive things I can say about that fucked up forum.

But know this; the domain name has been renewed. Hypoxia and I run our email through the domain name and we don't particularly want to change that in favor of something as messed up as Gmail.

Besides, this site annoys the piss out of some people. And that makes me smile.


Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:33 pm
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GodCoversHisEyes wrote:
Besides, this site annoys the piss out of some people. And that makes me smile.


True! Some of the best decree's have come from gothling.com.


Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:25 pm
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So, all of the talk is nil for Email addresses? Keeping it around to piss people off? ;) Heh.

Seriously, if it is still here, will the admins & mods keep it cleaned up & not allow spam?

I'm confused.

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Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:36 am
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GodCoversHisEyes wrote:
And that makes me smile.


Think of that, the next time the posting rate/quality starts to bug you... or when the domain nears expiration.

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Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:39 pm
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THIS SITE ANNOYS THE PISS OUT OF ME AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE IT ANYMORE!!!

GodCoversHisEyes wrote:
...that makes me smile.


Mon Aug 21, 2006 3:59 pm
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Oh my god.

Jamison posted.


YAY!

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Wed Aug 23, 2006 2:29 pm
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He was nearing his 30 day posting requirement before he got deleted
oh
BTW
It's +jamison+ to you Whitey

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Wed Aug 23, 2006 8:48 pm
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holy buckets, I'm not deleted! It's been a while since I logged on - cool.

Precursory disclaimer: please excuse this post, I am drunk.

I'm glad gothling is still going. If I didn't live in Texas, I'd probably still be checking it every day. You know what made the Saloon one of my favorite bars? All the gothlings that hung out there. I never really have conversations with people on myspace - it's like email with your picture attached to it. People talk to each other here, and it's nice. I never post on the Dallas goth message board - I don't like it.

If it were cancelled, though, I wouldn't be too upset. I agree that its heyday has come and gone. So Live Journal is where all the gothlings hang out now? I should start reading that.

I met Rockula here. Lots of sentimental attachment there.


Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:08 am
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Little Red Hen wrote:
So Live Journal is where all the gothlings hang out now? I should start reading that.


Pretty much.

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Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:09 am
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I'm just glad we got to see Hypoxia post again.

It's been, like ages. So it's good to see her around.

It was always one of my major motivations for posting.

You know, aside from arguing.

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Thu Aug 24, 2006 8:44 pm
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Yeah, I'm still around. Kinda. *heh*

So here is my decision:

Gothling will be around for one more year. After that, it is kaput. This gives time for people to figure out if they want to create something else on myspace or whereverthehellelse they wanna go, and those of you out of state have time to figure out how else to communicate with what's left of this community.

No, spammers will not be cleaned up or deleted while the board is around. Every last name has to be deleted manually, as does every entry, and there are no screening tools because this board is antiquated. I don't have the time or patience or emotional investment for that anymore. It's a major pain in the ass.

The gothling name will still be owned by me after the website is gone.

Sound good?


Sat Sep 09, 2006 12:04 pm
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hypoxia wrote:
Yeah, I'm still around. Kinda. *heh*

So here is my decision:

Gothling will be around for one more year. After that, it is kaput. This gives time for people to figure out if they want to create something else on myspace or whereverthehellelse they wanna go, and those of you out of state have time to figure out how else to communicate with what's left of this community.

No, spammers will not be cleaned up or deleted while the board is around. Every last name has to be deleted manually, as does every entry, and there are no screening tools because this board is antiquated. I don't have the time or patience or emotional investment for that anymore. It's a major pain in the ass.

The gothling name will still be owned by me after the website is gone.

Sound good?



This will then be our goodbye from our short stint on this board... Probably the same reason for your drop in member posting (Also the same reason we've stopped on other messageboards lately.): spammers. Can't take it seriously if it's not maintained. It's truly unprofessional, beyond being annoying.

Thanks for letting us post all of our events in the past though!

- Josh

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Sat Sep 09, 2006 1:07 pm
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I started on this board and in this community because it seemed like a refreshing group of intelligent, independent people who were generally interested in one another's welfare. A lot of the people who were here when I started have grown up and moved on to other things. Newer people have also come and gone. I've seen a lot of shallow behavior, heard a ton of unsubstantiated bullshit gossip and witnessed more than my fair share of "drama." What this "scene" has devolved into is worse than a high school drama department. It's not even much of a cohesive "scene" in any sense of the word. The club nights have become old and tired, the music stale and stagnant. There are no more impromptu gatherings, picnics or special events outside of "Goth Prom." Old posts on this board were fun, with people chiding one another and holding enjoyable converations. Now nobody has anything new or interesting to talk about.

Online journals and that corporate monster, MySpace, are where people spend most of their time now. There are great community messge boards out there where people are generally interested in communicating with a specific group, but this is not one of them. I don't think this particular "community" has the wherewithall to actually be a "community," in any sense of the word. People just don't care to contribute to something of that magnitude.

Years ago, Hard Mondays was busy every Monday. People looked forward to Monday each week to get out, hear banging industrial music, dance, drink and see all the other like-minded types they saw the previous week. Ground Zero had quite a following as well. The scene was rich and growing, with new faces popping up all the time. Now, club attendance is spotty (at best) and there isn't much excitement at all in what's going on.

For a year or so, I've been having much more fun on other local boards than I've had here. This place has become a chore, like something to which I'm chained. I don't laugh as much as I used to here. The good times are gone. So it's time to move on. I've tried everything I can think of over the past couple years to get this board back to where it was in the glory days, but I've received no reciprocation or effort from anyone else. I'm tired of it. What's the point in keeping it going?

And I get people saying to me, "But what about the Events forum? That's always active!" Not really. Hell, most acts don't even come here anymore anyway. Besides, you want to here about local events? Pick up a City Pages.


Sat Sep 09, 2006 4:23 pm
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GodCoversHisEyes wrote:
Hell, most acts don't even come here anymore anyway.


I'm with you on that, especially when colder weather rolls around the shows are even rarer... of course being too damn broke most of the time to make it out to the few shows that are left doesn't help either or for other people its that pesky smoking ban. Maybe all the members of this board should just uproot and move to Seattle... um, yeah... just a thought. But they had a ton of good shows going on when I was last out there. But realistically, the entire music scene in Minnesota has become stagnant.


Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:29 pm
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This makes me sad... The moment i read that Gothling may no longer be.... It only supports the problem with the darkside community already, some of the only things in MN that support the Goth comm. ARE forums like this where we can get in touch with each other and feel some sense of comunity. The Goth community is already being beaten down and trampled by the culture were in, i feel gothling is an integral part of the lifeblood of TC Goths. Thats just my opinion....

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Tue Sep 19, 2006 11:52 am
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Azrael_LJM wrote:
The Goth community is already being beaten down and trampled by the culture were in...

?? How exactly?

I've seen much of "the goth community" get old, lose interest, and fade away. But it wasn't due to any external cultural factors.

If the guv'ment was going around shutting down all the goth-friendly venues or something, your statement would make sense. But it's quite the contrary; there are plenty of places to go and things to do, but nobody shows up to them.

Except for the occasional big-name concert, when people that the rest of us have never seen before come out of the woodwork. But they vanish right back into the woodwork when the show's over.


Tue Sep 19, 2006 4:31 pm
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rskm1 wrote:
Except for the occasional big-name concert, when people that the rest of us have never seen before come out of the woodwork. But they vanish right back into the woodwork when the show's over.


posers. oops, sorry zom. poseurs.


Wed Sep 20, 2006 12:22 pm
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mzmelissa wrote:
posers. oops, sorry zom. poseurs.


shut-ins without an ISP

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Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:54 pm
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veinsplasher wrote:
shut-ins without an ISP


theyre prob still stuck in 1992 then too. eh, who needs em! ;)


Wed Sep 20, 2006 3:28 pm
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They might have a copy of Holy Smoke!!

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Thu Sep 21, 2006 12:08 pm
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