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 There's no 'yes' in sNOw 
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Post There's no 'yes' in sNOw
The Twin Towns Of Terror seem to be located within some vortex that pushes all snowstorms to either the north or south of us. Every major snowfall in the past few years has missed us. Our winters have gotten shorter, and we often make it to December without having received any significant accumulation. I don't believe it has anything to do with that Al Gore "global warming" bullshit that's popular in the pseudo-science circles, I just think this particular location has raised some kind of natural deflector shield repelling any and all frozen moisture.

Don't get me wrong, I really don't like snow and I'm not complaining. We still get the frigid temperatures, but no snow. I've been wondering what other people had to say on the subject. I hear snowboarding sales are down, so maybe all the emo and pop punk kids will move to Colorado and we can finally be rid of them.


Sat Dec 02, 2006 11:59 am
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It snowed here the other night
It was just enough to coat the tops of cars
This is weird because the day before it was warm
I must have heard the term "arctic blast" 10 times that day
I do miss Minneapolis in the winter though

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Sat Dec 02, 2006 3:51 pm
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We used to get all the snow. Tons of snow.

Say what you will but the global warming is responsible for the changing weather. And I hate not having snow. I want foot upon foot of deep snow and the colder the better.


Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:49 pm
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I believe in cyclical trends when it comes to weather. The Earth has actually been much warmer than it is now as well as much colder. This has nothing to do with mankind "destroying the planet." There is no way we could ever destroy the planet, and the hubris involved in such a claim is sickening. We could light off every nuclear warhead in the world and still not destroy the planet. We'd kill ourselves off, for sure, but not the planet. An asteroid over six miles wide struck the Earth with such force 65 million years ago that it wiped out all the dinosaurs. But it did not destroy the planet. This planet was around millions of years before us and will still be here millions of years after we're gone.

Al Gore makes a movie that has ridiculous factual distortions easily debunked by real scientists and tugs on the heartstrings by talking about his dead kid and you all buy into this global warming crap. Sorry, I'm just not that kind of hipster.

I believe what we're seeing is a natural rise in average temperatures that will persist for an indeterminate period of time until it naturally reverses itself. Nature always has been, and always will be, self-correcting - even in the face of outside influences. The evidence is all around you if you care to see it. We aren't nearly so powerful in the face of nature as some seem to think.

Anyway, I hate snow and always hope we can at least make it until December without having it on the ground. I just find it astounding how we keep getting missed by the big storms. People around the country think we're some kind of ice box always covered in white, yet our summers get uncomfortably hot and humid while our winters have been pretty mild for years.

I'll bet when we finally get hit, it will be unrelenting.


Sat Dec 02, 2006 9:52 pm
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Global warming is a $ grab scam. That being said, I see nothing wrong with trying to make the world cleaner & more beutifull. :)


Mon Dec 04, 2006 12:40 am
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global warming is a misnomer if ever there was one.

of course, thinking that what we do has no impact on the environment is foolish; claims that CO2 levels affect atmospheric conditions can not be wholly dismissed as some sort of leftist cash grab. weather is a complex system with sensitive dependence on initial conditions. (yay physics thesis)

that said, yeah, GCHE has a damned good point. natural climactic occurances are neither predictable nor entirely understood. the al gore vid seems to entirely dismiss the whole multifactorial causation tenet of ALL complex systems and focus, instead, on a single element: carbon dioxide.

volcanic eruptions have been increasing lately, which tends to have a global cooling effect, due to ash inhibiting sun light. but, if i were, say, an idiot, and focused solely on that one factor, all my evidence would seem to point to an imminent ice age.

of course, an ice age IS imminent, but, hey, thats geologically speaking.

(rim shot)

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Mon Dec 04, 2006 1:15 am
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I'm definately not defending Al Gore but how is this a cash grab scam (other than getting people to buy a book and/or movie)?
If this is the case then we have once again seen the liberals play on a much a smaller court than the conservatives
There's no way global warming could ever turn a profit like war

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Mon Dec 04, 2006 4:25 pm
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Hey! It snowed today! yaaayyyyyy!
I hope it gets -30 & it snows lots so we have to burn lots of oil, (or bio carbons like me & zom) & the streets get cleaner! ;)


Mon Dec 04, 2006 7:09 pm
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Rockula! wrote:
If this is the case then we have once again seen the liberals play on a much a smaller court than the conservatives
There's no way global warming could ever turn a profit like war


Um, Kyoto? We are talking about Trillions to pay for an un-proven dooms day scare.

But yes, the liberals will be crushed like wallnuts. :)


Mon Dec 04, 2006 7:13 pm
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2fisted wrote:
Rockula! wrote:
If this is the case then we have once again seen the liberals play on a much a smaller court than the conservatives
There's no way global warming could ever turn a profit like war


Um, Kyoto? We are talking about Trillions to pay for an un-proven dooms day scare.

But yes, the liberals will be crushed like wallnuts. :)


Every time I read a post by John, I wonder "Is he Stupid? Is he Ignorant? Is He Crazy? Or is he Full of Shit?"

and now I realize-

he's all of the above.

Global warming is about as un-proven as tectonic theory- no, we're not going to destroy the planet, we're going to catastrophically disrupt our ability to produce food. Which is inevitable, really, with the cultural system we've built over the past 6,000 years... but, it would be nice to not see it happen within my lifetime. If it does, I think I'll try to subsist as long as possible off of neo-cons.

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Mon Dec 04, 2006 7:20 pm
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2fisted wrote:
I see nothing wrong with trying to make the world cleaner & more beutifull. :)


Agreed.

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Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:01 am
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drok_vox wrote:
I think I'll try to subsist as long as possible off of neo-cons.


as opposed too.....

This could be the plan your looking for then vox! :)

http://www.local6.com/news/10469771/detail.html


Tue Dec 05, 2006 6:51 pm
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2fisted wrote:
as opposed too.....



think more along the lines of "soylent green is people who thought global warming was a liberal conspiracy"

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Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:34 pm
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Post Get yer t-shirts right here!
Soylent Green Is People T-shirts!

http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts/generic/6e87/


Thu Dec 07, 2006 9:10 pm
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GodCoversHisEyes wrote:
We could light off every nuclear warhead in the world and still not destroy the planet. We'd kill ourselves off, for sure, but not the planet. An asteroid over six miles wide struck the Earth with such force 65 million years ago that it wiped out all the dinosaurs. But it did not destroy the planet. This planet was around millions of years before us and will still be here millions of years after we're gone.


And then the sun will turn into a cold star. But that's hardly the point.
The point is we are effecting our environment. OUR environment. The playingfield that we exist on. Regardless of how long the planet "survives" is quite moot to most humankind, considering we are talking terms within our own context in the first place.

If we create an environment that is unsustainable, then what the hell does it matter to us if the mountains haven't fallen into the sea?

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Thu Dec 28, 2006 10:06 pm
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And I totally agree with that. The burning of fossil fuels creates toxic gases that are harmful to humans. This needs to be changed. Pollution is a rotten thing. It needs to be stopped. Nuclear energy is harmful to humans as well. We will not progress as a society until we change these things completely. The problem is, the Liberal sorts just want to attack Industry mindlessly and say, "It needs to stop right now!!!" Never mind the fact that this would mean the total, instant collapse of society as we know it. They're not concerned with that. They're too damn ignorant to even consider the ramifications. Meanwhile, the dumbass Conservatives throw conniption fits at the very idea that we coax the Oil and Power industries into hastening the discoveries and implementations of alternate power sources. It might interrupt the flow of fat to the fatcats, and Conservatives don't like to see their rich, bloated buddies take a hit.

But all this crap about how we're melting the polar ice caps because of SUVs and hairspray is as full of shit as...well, pretty much anything that comes out of the mouths of Al Gore and Greenpeace. If we shoveled everything they say into bags, we could keep America green forever.


Fri Dec 29, 2006 12:56 am
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no, its not how efficient our cars are, or how much we recycle, or how energy efficient we make anything, the problem has nothing to do with technology

we can slow down pollution for sure, but its not going to reverse anything

the problem is us, it comes down to population control, and that will never happen, no one is going to make a movie telling people to procreate wisely... have 3 kids and youll make more of an impact than driving around an SUV your entire lifetime

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 1:32 am
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what does mutlifactorial causation mean again?





i hate being the only scientist...

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:49 am
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According to Al Gore, the world will end in 9 years 30 days 15 hours and 30 minutes!

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:29 am
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I'm amused by these global warming discussions as most people have no idea what they're talking about (1.5 of the above posters are exceptions).

Have you recently spent any time paging through the Climate Diagnostic Bulletin or any other academic journal on the subject matter? Probably not. Whether you believe or don't believe in global warming, you probably don't have adequate knowledge of the subject matter. You just buy into one hype or another.

(oh and local weather change is not adequate means of checking for global warming, that can only be done statistically - or at least that's the argument)

It's also a bit of a myth that environmentalists aren't industry friendly. Many environmentalists have a very capitalist-utopiac vision of the world and use neo-liberal logic at its best (al gore is very much in that camp).


Fri Dec 29, 2006 11:52 am
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Liighter wrote:
Have you recently spent any time paging through the Climate Diagnostic Bulletin or any other academic journal on the subject matter?


yes, and aver 2/3 of everyone's models show that in addition to normal geological activity, human carbon emissions impact the climate.

the ice shelf that just broke loose in canadia?

liberal conspiracy.

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:07 pm
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Liighter wrote:
(oh and local weather change is not adequate means of checking for global warming, that can only be done statistically - or at least that's the argument)


lol Even the "liberal conspiracy" believes warming is indicated by ice core samples taken from the ever-decreasing arctic!!!

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:30 pm
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well i agree the 'global warming' deal is more about politics, and people adopting it to give their opinion 'power'

as to the idea of 'global warming' you can identify it as existing or not, but im saying population is a larger problem

and the idea of what the climate should be is only relative to a timespan you compare it to, earths atmosphere has changed quite a bit in composition before humans were even around, so some ice melts and it doesnt snow, and people want to claim humans are able to destroy earth

i really doubt humans have the capability of permanently destroying the atmosphere you can burn a forest and it will come back, so thinking that humans really play that significant of a role is being arrogant


(we can destroy plant and animal diversity tho),

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 7:06 pm
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the earth is warming. period. end of story. polar ice caps are shrinking. glaciers are rapidly retreating, and not coming back in the winter. the gulf stream is slowing down. it's happening.

the issue is the cause. is human industry responsible for it? I believe so... models from all over the world, from all sorts of "political" camps suggest that yes, carbon emissions from our industry are responsible for the earth retaining heat.

are we going to "break" the planet? oh hell no. not possible. life will survive. the species itself will probably survive.

population IS a huge part of the problem- we're going to push our environment to a snapping point, and mass agriculture will fail massively. starvation, collapse of everything, dogs and cats living together...

we could have headed it off, if the "alarmists" of 20 years ago would have been payed some attention, and not just been pejoratively labeled as "a liberal conspiracy".

the food will run out, probably in our life times. when it does, I, for one, plan on killing and eating people who thought that global warming was a myth.

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 7:18 pm
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Fuck the "liberal conspiracy".... (and I'm sure the reasoning is due to the current political climate more than a deep-seaded belief,) ....but even the BUSHIES/ US administration are admitting to global warming now!!!! *shock*

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 8:32 pm
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myfoxwghp article

The world IS coming to an end!! *lol*




||MODERATOR NOTE: inline URL converted to hyperlink to avoid horizontal scrollbar.

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Fri Dec 29, 2006 8:33 pm
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drok_vox wrote:
the food will run out, probably in our life times. when it does, I, for one, plan on killing and eating people who thought that global warming was a myth.


Bring it on. I'm willing to bet I will be feasting on your flesh (with a side of fava beans and a nice chianti) as we enter into the next ice age. Guarunteed.


Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:32 am
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drok_vox wrote:
I, for one, plan on killing and eating people who thought that global warming was a myth.


You mean you would actualy work for food rather than mootch off others!? This I'm gonna have to see! :)


Sat Dec 30, 2006 4:57 pm
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2fisted wrote:
You mean you would actualy work for food rather than mootch off others!? This I'm gonna have to see! :)


wait, I forget what it is you do... do you own a farm, or run a fishing trawler?

or do you "mooch" off of others as well?

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Sat Dec 30, 2006 5:19 pm
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i make pacemakers.

yippee!

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Sat Dec 30, 2006 6:05 pm
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Well, I figure if global warming gets to be too much of a problem, we can just nuke a couple mountains' worth of dust into the atmosphere and balance things out with a lil' of that Nuclear Winter they were promising us in the 80's.


Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:26 am
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rskm1 wrote:
worth of dust into the atmosphere and balance things out with a lil' of that Nuclear Winter they were promising us in the 80's.


scientists like Carl Sagan already promised us that when saddam lit the oil fields in 92. of course, nothing happened.


Tue Jan 02, 2007 2:25 am
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Food will run out? Oh please. We got farmers getting paid NOT to grow stuff.

Overpopulation? Pshaw. War - what's it good for? Getting rid of people, that's what. We'll just have another war or three. To quote the old Soviet saying - no man, no problem. I find it quite ironic that people decrying overpopulation and protesting war are often the same...

I have spent about a week reading all I could find on global warming a while ago. The conclusion that I came to is that anyone who says "there is hard evidence that..." or "scientists agree that..." in relation to this topic is full of shit.

First off, we only have definite climatic data on little more than the last century. In the scope of the planet and global climate that's a blink in a lifetime. Yes, there is geologic data. However, what this data means is in dispute.

Human activity probably has some impact. The degree of said impact is once again far from agreed-upon. There is some question whether cow farts or car exhaust cause more warming.

There is also some research that suggests that even if we were to stop all the warming-related activities (kill the cows, quit driving and burning shit) that will have no effect on impending climate change. The methane trapped on the sea bottom will be released by the warmed seawater and we will be screwed anyway.



I say, if this global warming thing works out, might as well make the best of it. Move to high ground and buy shorts, Minnesota will be the next Florida.


Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:59 am
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You mean the ocean will start farting?
Will surfers ride the fart waves wearing gas masks?

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Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:25 am
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Rockula! wrote:
You mean the ocean will start farting?
Will surfers ride the fart waves wearing gas masks?
Hm. Maybe Butthole Surfers will enjoy a surge in popularity...


Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:00 pm
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JPaganel wrote:
Overpopulation? Pshaw. War - what's it good for? Getting rid of people, that's what. We'll just have another war or three.



naw, war wont get rid of overpopulation... it takes a lot of time to kill people in a war, and a lot of organization and money on both sides... and even a deadly bacteria or virus is tricky to have an effect on a lot of pple, if its too deadly, pple will die before it spreads. and slow spreading is caught and halted


nothing short of an asteroid will have a dent on humans im afraid

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Thu Jan 04, 2007 12:44 am
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did I say anything about a threat to the species? no---- our maltreatment of the environment a threat to this culture/civilization. now, nothing is eternally viable- cro-magnon culture was so far one of the most succesful. as far as a species, we're very young, and as far as cultures go, this one is barely a blink in the eye of the species.

what concerns myself, and others like me, is finding a way to back away from where we're heading without suffering cataclysmic collapse (think rome x 1000).

of course, that's all from the liberal conspiracy point of view.

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Thu Jan 04, 2007 6:17 pm
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what??!?! what do you mean finding a way back!!

theres no turning back unless you have cataclysmic collapse, you gotta look at the long term here, humans are gonna go extinct, this will happen, the one thing humankind could do that would be worthwhile would be to make something that could outlast them, (and theres really nothing except something like the borg, humans next step in evolution is to intelligent humanoid machines)

as for simple things like the weather, theres no way humans could control it, or fix it... you would have to control the sun, and essentially all gas emissions (including volcanoes) and plant life on earth, and theres also loose theories about how the magnetic shield has an effect on the atmosphere (the idea that mars had more of an atmosphere before its core cooled down and the poles disappeared, leaving the atmosphere to be blown away by the solar wind)


so yeah, far from the days where man thought earth was the center of the solar system, we now think we can control the atmosphere

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Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:16 pm
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Hey man, as long as it means we get to keep these 40+ degree January days with no snow, then bring on the global warming. I couldn't care less if the coasts slide into the sea or the southern states bake to a crisp (not like they had anything to offer humanity anyway).


Fri Jan 05, 2007 12:46 am
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evilgod wrote:
what??!?! what do you mean finding a way back!!

theres no turning back unless you have cataclysmic collapse,


dude- read, comprehend, respond.

I said, in the post, that nothing is eternally viable- of course human beings are going to go away. I'm talking about culture- and ours is getting to the point of being self-aware enough, as a culture, to refute you're (asinine) "theres no turning back unless you have cataclysmic collapse" thesis.

in fact, what kind of supporting evidence do you have for that? it seems to me that many, many cultures have managed to fade away quietly or transition into other cultures (cahokia, han dynasty, for two...).

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Fri Jan 05, 2007 1:26 am
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So is the global warming gone now?

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Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:11 pm
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The global warming isn't gone....

One thing that has been happening some winters is the northern hemisphere is two pockets of air.... Half the globe gets a warm pocket, and the other half gets a cold pocket. That's usually northern Asia (Siberia), and North America (Canada). Instead of circulating in systems like normal, they just stay, maybe wobble. They switch very abruptly, which happened about a week and a half ago, now.

I'm hoping that we get a new ice age, soon.
(Now is not the time to buy property in the Red River valley.)


Sat Jan 20, 2007 11:53 am
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The planet is in a warming trend. In fact we are still coming out of the last ice age. We are also polluting and fucking up our environment with all kinds of shit. The question is, does the latter contribute to the former??

Currently, the polular science of the day says that it does. This conclusion is however highly interpretive, and based on models with very few datapoints. Its like trying to predict what an elephant looks like by examining its toenail. Personally, I see climatolgy and meteorology as more voodoo than science. I mean seriously, when someone claims that they understand the reasons for climactic changes going back thousands and hundreds of thousands of years, but can't tell me if its gonna fucking rain tomorrow or not, I find their claims highly suspect.

Heres where I think most people miss the point though - why the hell does it matter?? We need to stop fucking our shit up either way. We need to find safer, non-polluting energy sources for 'real' reasons. We didn't evolve out of the stone-age because our use of stones was destroying the planet, or because we were on the verge of running out of stones. No, we evolved from the stone-age because we discovered better solutions. We will evolve from a fossil-fuel based civilization for the same reasons - a better solution will be found for our energy problems - not because of a bunch of whiney ass fuckers with predictions of doom and gloom.

Even if these assholes are right about global warming and fossil fuels and such, we simply dont need them. We will either evolve as a species, or we'll die the fuck off. People are working on solving the problem, with or without a bunch of whiney ass activist fucks annoying everyone. Yes, we know you care, so how about doing something constructive about that - become a scientist and work the problem, buy a hybrid or a windmill or a solar powered toilet or something. Just please, pretty please, shut the fuck up and stop annoying the rest of us.

Thank you.

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Sat Jan 20, 2007 1:32 pm
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