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 Semantics: Shouldn't it be "suicide success" 
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Post Semantics: Shouldn't it be "suicide success"
Here's a section from a breaking story on the AP:
"Opera singer Jerry Hadley dead at 55 1 hour, 12 minutes ago



POUGHKEEPSIE, N.Y. - Jerry Hadley, the world-class tenor known for his agile and lyric voice, died Wednesday, a week after he shot himself in an apparent suicide attempt.

The 55-year-old singer died two days after doctors at St. Francis Hospital in Poughkeepsie took him off life support, said family friend and spokeswoman Celia Novo.

Hadley, who had been battling personal problems, shot himself with an air rifle July 10 at his home in Clinton Corners, 80 miles north of New York City. State police said he was found unconscious on his bedroom floor."


Now, if he died, after shooting himself, and the shooting lead directly to his death, should it really be called an "attempt?" He's dead. I attempted to learn german. I can't speak fluent german, so it was just an attempt. This guy, on the other hand, got his desired end result. So, I think it should say "... he shot himself in a successful suicide effort."

Of course, I'm always amazed when people fail to die right away when they shoot themselves, but we aren't all perfect.


Wed Jul 18, 2007 2:04 pm
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this is an incredibly calloused and insensitive post.

suicide is not funny or something to laugh or make jokes about.


Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:39 pm
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only rape is funny, really.

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Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:45 pm
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HAHAHA!


Wed Jul 18, 2007 4:49 pm
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The people who label suicide as a selfish act are the most selfish of all
I have had friends commit suicide and, although it hurt me, I realise that it is their right to do with their own lives as they will
It is a self centered position to take when you dictate the terms of someone else's existance (or lack therof)
As far as joking about it, I didn't find it particularly amusing but I sure as fuck am not offended

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Wed Jul 18, 2007 5:14 pm
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Semantics, schemantics.

I wanna know wheres I can git me one o' them air rifles what is pow'rful 'nuff ta kill a fellar!


Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:57 pm
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flashy wrote:
this is an incredibly calloused and insensitive post.

suicide is not funny or something to laugh or make jokes about.


At exactly what point, precisely, was I making a joke about suicide? I was merely expressing my minor irritation with how an article was worded, hence it being under the heading of "Semantics." If I wanted to make a joke about suicide, I would have put it under "Jokes about suicide." I was not laughing, or joking, or finding anything about the actual content humorous. I was just asking about how something is worded, and if it couldn't be worded better.
The most you could say is that the last sentence sounds a bit flip, but I am genuinely amazed when people, despite all the factors against them, survive (even for a bit) an attempt to kill themselves by gun. But again, I was not even meaning to be flip about it.


Thu Jul 19, 2007 1:34 am
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Haakon wrote:
The most you could say is that the last sentence sounds a bit flip, but I am genuinely amazed when people, despite all the factors against them, survive (even for a bit) an attempt to kill themselves by gun. But again, I was not even meaning to be flip about it.


perhaps i am a little sensitive about the issue due to recent events. i appreciate your courteous response.


Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:00 am
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flashy wrote:
Haakon wrote:
The most you could say is that the last sentence sounds a bit flip, but I am genuinely amazed when people, despite all the factors against them, survive (even for a bit) an attempt to kill themselves by gun. But again, I was not even meaning to be flip about it.


perhaps i am a little sensitive about the issue due to recent events. i appreciate your courteous response.


Understood.


Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:57 am
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So
What you are saying is that we have to check with you first before we post something that might make you a little sensitive?

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Thu Jul 19, 2007 4:25 pm
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No I don't think that is what he said- but maybe you should think before you put a boot in your mouth and look like an idiot.
I have had 4 friends commit suicide over the years and recently another one attempted too unsuccessfully.
It is hard to take when you are the one left behind.
And I personally think suicide is cowardly and selfish because the person commiting suicide is thinking only of himself at the time of the act and not how his actions will impact the lives of those who love him, need him, work with him, ect...
The only thing that stopped me from even attempting it was thinking of my girls and how they would have to be left behind with the questions and maybe the guilt if they thought they had something to do with it.
Nothing in life is so hard that it cannot be resolved with time and patients. And the cowardly part is thinking you can't make it through.


Thu Jul 19, 2007 5:13 pm
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LeXi wrote:
No I don't think that is what he said- but maybe you should think before you put a boot in your mouth and look like an idiot.
I have had 4 friends commit suicide over the years and recently another one attempted too unsuccessfully.
It is hard to take when you are the one left behind.
And I personally think suicide is cowardly and selfish because the person commiting suicide is thinking only of himself at the time of the act and not how his actions will impact the lives of those who love him, need him, work with him, ect...
The only thing that stopped me from even attempting it was thinking of my girls and how they would have to be left behind with the questions and maybe the guilt if they thought they had something to do with it.
Nothing in life is so hard that it cannot be resolved with time and patience. And the cowardly part is thinking you can't make it through.


-So, my great-grandmother, who requested to be euthanized (and was by her doctor) because she was in such severe pain from her advanced cancer, was "cowardly?" No, actually, she was just in pain, and wanted it to end. That is the reason people typically kill themselves, because they don't see themselves as having any options. I've had friends who have killed themselves as well, and the reason they did it was to escape the pain of being alive, and end the hopelessness they felt. Yes, it's selfish (by definition). So is just about every act and behavior we commit. The problem is, this is acting someone who is irrational to think and act rationally. The only rational, well-considered thought they are having is "if I die, this will end." Having been to that point myself, I speak from experience. You aren't able to even acknowledge that there is anyone else, as you feel completely disconnected. I try to not judge too harshly the acts of people who commit suicide, as I know just how bad they must have felt to do it. All I can feel is pity.


Fri Jul 20, 2007 1:26 am
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And saddness because I know how lonley they must feel to want to do that.

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Fri Jul 20, 2007 7:42 am
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For a person to make the choice to do what he or she wants with their own life and body and commit suicide is not selfish or cowardly. It is their choice. It is beyond criticism. I have known a number of people who have killed themselves, and I respect their decision to do so. It wasn't my life to live, it was theirs, and I wouldn't presume to hover over them waving my finger like a tyrant and telling them what they have to do with their lives.

The caveat to that is when someone leaves behind children or a needy family. There's certainly no character in screwing over other people by removing yourself from the equation. Yes, suicide is selfish. Of course it is selfish. It's a decision to end your self. But so long as that doesn't put others in a dire position, I respect the decision.


Fri Jul 20, 2007 8:07 am
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Choice yes.
Selfish yes.
Choices can be selfish.
I choose ot think it cowardly and selfish.

Euthanisation is a completely different topic. I believe in it by the way. But only because I believe in choice.


Fri Jul 20, 2007 12:04 pm
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